I have recently had my positivity and that of this blog challenged in a very rational and structured way by a gentlemen calling himself “Preacher”. I have my opinions about his point of view and I will respond to his comments below:
Preacher’s comment:
I continue to grow incredibly frustrated with fellow South Africans who seem to share this mentality where a poor attitude is one of the biggest challenges facing the average disgruntled South African. Being positive about the situation in South Africa is one thing, being absolutely blind to the reality of the situation is another thing altogether. Every time you raise the issue of crime, poor service delivery or rising living costs, you get the same response. “Get off your behind and do something about it!” What most people fail to realize is that by paying your taxes and being a good citizen, you are doing something about the situation. You are making a positive contribution.
I am a white male aged 28. Being the indirect benefactor of Apartheid has automatically made me the villain, nothing more then another pale face who has to pay for the sins of his forefathers. Enough about my past though. I wanted to get that out of the way so that you could automatically put me into whatever box you put people like to put me into. Im sure you have a label for it. We South Africans love nothing more then to label and classify people.
Lets, however, rather look at my present situation and possible future. One that is shared by quite a few South Africans of which a fair percentage are beginning to feel the way I do. Perhaps the positive South Africans would be able to elaborate exactly where I am wrong in my cynicism and highlight exactly why I should change my attitude to that of a positive South African. I need examples here. After all, it seems that negativity is almost as big an issue as crime, HIV and unemployment. It has to be. I mean, every time you dare complain about the state of the nation you are called a negative whining spoilt brat. Perhaps once I have been enlightened my perception of the current challenges we face will be accepted with glee instead of the growing frustration I face daily. Im not quite sure. Making an informed decision alone just does not seem to cut it.
Being a white male graduate, I have to contend with Affirmative Action. Sins of the past may be political justification for the policy but the government has gone to great lengths to make me difficult to employ, regardless of my skills and career record. I would love the opportunity to start my own business, but BEE has made opportunities to do business, particularly for white male graduates with an Afrikaans surname, very difficult indeed. Unless I am prepared to gift someone 26% of my business I will have to face the reality of not being able to do business with a large portion of listed companies, larger private companies and government itself. Not only has the government made me difficult to employ, they have made it difficult for me to employ myself. I have been marginalized from participating in the economy as a result. My contributions are not limited through lack of intent or desire. They are limited by legislation. My attitude and outlook cant change the law.
Fortunately though, I do have work at the moment. Unfortunately, I have to pay almost 40% of my salary in tax. So I donate a fair whack of change every month to the Government. I call this a donation for good reason. These taxes offer very little in the way of the basic services one would expect from a Government that takes 40% of your salary in the first place. It’s a tough pill to swallow, but being from a privileged background, I do understand that my contribution has to be a little greater then the majority. However, the lack of basic services means that there are the indirect taxes that we all have to pay over and above income tax. The fact that the government cant provide me with decent health care, a capable police force and schooling for my children one day, means that I incur the expense of a medical aid plan, investment funds to cover tuition when they my kids need to go to school, security companies that I pay to protect my house and tracker systems for my car. Before I have even paid VAT, I am taxed almost 60% of my basic salary.
The remaining 40% or so of my salary has to cover the major expenses of a house, car, food and my “excellent” South African lifestyle. I lived overseas for a while, so I missed the property bandwagon. To buy a decent house now is going to cost me almost 1 million Rand. At the current interest rate, I am looking at repayments of almost R12 000 a month. All of a sudden, as a percentage of my income, housing in Australia and Canada does not seem so pricey. With their interest rates, its not only affordable, but an actual possibility.
Am I being negative when I complain about car prices? The simple fact that we don’t have a public transport system means I have no choice but to buy a car. Obligated to buy a car in a country where government levies and manufacturer margins are so high we are probably one of the most expensive countries in the world when it comes to buying a new car. Perhaps there is a positive spin we can put on this complaint? Perhaps the cost of insurance is a positive? I consider this being held to ransom more then anything else, but a positive spin on this would be appreciated to.
As for safety? We live in a country where I look over my shoulder constantly. I have come to accept the fact that my children wont be able to ride their bikes to school.My future wife is going to have to deal with constant calls from me to make sure she has reached her destination safely. The police cant protect me and seem incapable of doing so when you look at our soaring crime statistics. I did join the local neighborhood watch, but when government passed legislation that makes gun ownership difficult, I had to throw in the towel.
Lets look at the rest of the situation as it stands at the moment. The ones that don’t affect us directly, but will have an impact on all of us in the long term. We are losing the battle with HIV, deciding to fight the pandemic with garlic and an exercise program rather than education and anti retrovirals. We have illegal immigrants pouring into South Africa, which is only going to further drain social services and lead to more crime. The majority from a country that continue to inflict human rights abuses on its own people daily, with the complete support of our current Government when you consider their silence.
We hear stories of corruption in government and municipalities almost daily. The standard of education has been dropped to accommodate poor standards of schooling and a Government that is more worried about the number of matrics its churns out instead of producing matrics with a solid education. The skills shortage has been amplified by the droves of people leaving. We have different university entry requirements for people of different races. Infrastructure is struggling to cope because of poor management.
I am being called a pessimist because I complain about discrimination that limits my involvement in the economy, an economy that taxes 40% of my salary, an economy driven by me purchasing services that my taxes should cover. For that luxury, I have to deal with soaring living costs where property, transport and daily living expenses are starting to rival first world countries. (I should know, I was abroad for two years. The “South Africa is CHEAP” argument is flawed). To complement the soaring living expenses, I also have to deal with the constant fear of violent crime that I may have to experience.
What exactly is keeping me here? What is keeping you here? Other then family and friends, South Africa has absolutely nothing left to offer me. It may be my home, but its no longer a country I feel welcome in. If I am not being made to feel like a second rate citizen through legislation, I am being made to ask forgiveness constantly for a system my grandfather voted in.
Before you suggest it, I have already made my decision to emigrate. I have heard it all before. Pessimists like me are not needed in South Africa. You don’t need cynics in South Africa, you need people of action. So Ill take my skills, my tax money, my education and my savings I have accrued elsewhere.
There are four types of “positive” South Africans. The trapped, the blind, the very brave and the insane. To those that are forced to stick it out, I wish you all the best. To the very brave ones, I commend you. I hope the gamble pays off. To the blind ones, I implore you to become a little more aware of your surroundings and maybe read a newspaper from time to time. To the insane ones, please let the rest of us know what we need to do to get a job in Government. It seems to pay quite well.
OK! That is one helluva comment that was posted on this blog. I have emailed Preacher asking if I can repost this comment on SA Rocks, but I found the original post on his blog so put it in here regardless. I am sure that he’ll get a kick out of receiving linklove from a pro-SA blog!
After reading this post I visited the blog and must admit it’s filled with lots of swearing, aggression and what seems like regret and hatred to me. So I don’t suggest reading it. It’s the usual “I’m leaving SA so I should make a start on badmouthing it now” blog. Read one, read them all.
I decided to contact Preacher personally via email after reading the comment. I think I was decent, I told him that I am sorry that he is emigrating and happy that he is making a choice he is contented with. I also told him that I am one of the brave, not the insane, blind or dumb.
My brief rebuttal:
Firstly I don’t disagree with much of the factual content that is displayed above. I disagree with the approach taken, the tone and the sentiments behind the post.
I believe in affirmative action as I have stated on this blog before. I believe that if you are the BEST candidate you will get the job, race is irrelevant more often than not. Don’t get pissed off if a person of colour gets a job ahead of you, if you were clearly the best candidate you would’ve gotten the job. On that point, don’t tell me I live in a dream world, I have many friends, associates and colleagues who have high powered, high paying, high profile jobs with people of colour in the companies, below, above and next to them. So it happens, believe it or not, white people do actually get jobs. In fact I was employed ahead of various people of colour, age and creed not 3 months ago.
Individual abstinence from action regarding SA is like individual abstinence from helping Global Warming. To say that you are leaving because it’s not your job, duty or problem to try and help the situation is like damning our Earth to a lifetime of suffering because you can’t fix climate change. You can fix climate change. Simply changing the sort of light bulb you use makes a difference. In the same way that staying and trying makes a difference in SA.
Everyone on Earth, in any country, pays taxes and contributes in very similar ways to their country as the Preacher mentions in his comments. That is the bare minimum, not the maximum, that a citizen can do for their country. If you want to be one of the “brave” then so be it, if that involves me running this blog and talking and blogging about the great things this country has to offer then so be it, I will gladly go above and beyond the normal requirements.
This post is quite long enough (the longest I have blogged I think) so I wont continue on for too long, I will let the debate spark from here. But let me just say that I don’t believe that every country has equal beauty, equal success or equal failure. All of these things are relative. Relative beauty, success and failure. SA is a stunning country but that is not all we are. We have friendly people, the most progressive constitution in the world, the largest hospital in the world, SA’s banking sector is considered to be the eighth-most developed among countries with a population greater than 20 million people – ahead of France and Japan. These are all things that you probably didn’t know about our amazing country.
Yes there are flaws, I do not deny this fact. But let me assure anyone leaving or staying that every country has relative flaws that they are not proud of or are trying to correct. It takes time for a leaving South African or entering foreigner to understand, realise and experience these issues. The grass is not always greener.
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September 6th, 2007 at 12:58 pm
Having read the comments by Preacher on BEE I thought that I should mention the following. In terms of the codes of good practice “exempt micro enterprises” and “qualifying small enterprises” were created.
Exempt micro enterprises has a turnover of up to R5million a year and is exempt from the BEE regime.
Qualifying small enterprises has a turnover of between R5 and R35 million. These can select 4 out of 7 possible criteria for their broad based BEE rating. Therefore they need not select ownership.
When calculating “preferential procurement” 3 out of 20 possible points is scored based on procurement from small and micro enterprises. In addition full credit is given to all procurement from micro enterprises as if they are 100% BEE compliant. Therefore, there are incentives to procure from small business.
Having said all this it should be obvious that unless preacher is aiming to start a business with a revenue exceeding R35 million a year, the BEE codes could actually work in his favour.
More information at http://www.dti.gov
September 6th, 2007 at 1:22 pm
Thank you so much. I wasn’t wholly aware of these facts! Appreciate the comment.
September 6th, 2007 at 2:52 pm
Sure accountant that micro brewery crap aint going to last when they start pulling off these wonderfully racist http://iafrica.com/news/sa/729341.htm procurement ideals, the council even paid R7000 more to buy something from a blackman fabulous… run for your life,screaming,white man your time is up….
September 6th, 2007 at 3:04 pm
me – You can pick a thousand examples of things gone bad and I promise you that there are 1000 examples of positive things that exist too. We just aren’t looking hard enough.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:14 pm
I would like to thank Nic up front for his timely response.
I would like to address each point individually, as I feel by providing a better indication of who I am and where I stand will press home my viewpoint more effectively, as I feel that I have been a bit misrepresented by his review of the GoonSquad Blog.
Firstly, regarding the blog, it is not my blog alone. It is a blog that has contributions from more then one member. The group comprises of people with differing opinions, outlooks and posting styles. My point of view is not a representation of all members. The GoonSquad has come together for one purpose, and that was to address the growing issue of censorship and candy coated opinions that we feel has overwhelmed the South African public and media over the last few years. This has spilled over to forums and blogs too. All contributors are free to post and pass comment without moderation, so long as its not abusive or could be considered hate speech. As such, it would appear that many of the posts are going to be rather aggressive.
When one considers that we are predominantly South African, and the multitudes of issues that we face as a people, it is to be expected that such a vocal group would be commenting on the issues they have. Is it a blog and website with the sole aim of bashing South Africa? Hardly. The last thing in anyone’s mind when the blog was put together was to attack South Africa. That was never the intention. However, considering the reality of the situation we face, it is inevitable that this would happen from time to time. If you look at the content of the blog, not every contribution has been one that anyone could consider an attack on our country. Then again, I suppose when everyone likes to bash the media for being negative and creating this perception of a country in trouble, so we must accept the fact that perhaps our blog is going to suffer the same fate.
Secondly, I would like to address Nic’s statement that I am yet another disgruntled South African looking to justify my decision to emigrate. That is simply not the case. Just like “a positive outlook” is thrown into the face of unhappy South Africans, so is the argument that negativity is often nothing more then a justification for people looking to leave, or for those that have already done so. Im not looking to vindicate my decision to leave. Common sense was more then enough. I weighed up my options, and those of my family. It would be irresponsible to stay. For me.
Im not miserable or negative. I don’t lack a positive disposition. There is no regret or hate. My decision to move IS a positive one. I am just flat out angry. Im angry that my home and my country are being run into the ground. I am angry that a country with such a prejudicial background continues to classify people by race. Im angry that I am being treated like a second rate citizen. I am angry that I have to live in fear of crime, be it at home or on the street. I am angry that I cant contribute to the economy effectively because legislation prohibits my involvement simply because I have a white skin. I am angry that I have to pay so much tax. I am angry that family and friends have had to suffer from violent crime. I am angry that corruption is not being dealt with. I am angry that sports teams are not selected on merit. I am angry to see the way the neighborhood I grew up in has gone to the pits. I am just flat out fucking angry.
You talk of me looking to justify my reasons to leave? Look at a “positive South African’s” justification for the situation as it stands. We use “imbalances of the past” as justification for racial discrimination. We use “social ills inherited from the previous regime” as justification for poor service delivery. We use poverty as justification for violent crimes like rape and the torture of our families in our homes. We use social conditioning as justification for the attacks on farmers. We justify mediocrity way to easily and the result is a country that is on the decline.
Now, concerning your rebuttal. AA might be a policy you agree with, but to say that it is fair would be unjust. AA is one of the major reasons why we are in the middle of a brain drain. Skills have become so scarce that companies can employ certain skill sets simply because of the void that has been created. The irony is you support a system, in the belief that you and your friends are not suffering because of it, that actually does more harm to the economy then good. Your anecdotal outlook is hardly one that paints an accurate picture Im afraid. The long term effects of Affirmative Action are dire. They will have an impact on skills development, economic growth, inflation, our ability to compete on the international stage. I can elaborate further if you wish.
Ill agree that we do have one of the most advanced banking systems. We also have one of the most expensive. You need to do your research. Our largest hospital is in a shambles, not to mention health in general. Don’t even let me get started on Manto and the HIV issue. Our constitution may look good on paper, but in practice its failing. People live in fear, people feel discriminated against, criminals have more rights then civilians, our labour market is restrictive. I could go on for hours. This is not negativity. This is the reality of the situation. I describe only what is happening.
As for the rest of your post suggesting that by leaving SA we are adding to the problem? I could not agree more. SA needs people to stay. However, I cannot stay where I dont feel welcome. As long as I am taxed to hell and back, have the constant threats to my safety(violent crime against whites IS hate crime) and have legislation in place that limits my involvement in the economy? You are going to have to do a damn good job convincing me that South Africa has more to offer then the UK, Australia, NZ, Canada, USA, Western Europe, etc. The grass IS greener when you come to the nuts and bolts of the matter.
All due respect to everyone on this site but people have no idea how difficult it is to leave your home. You are leaving behind family, friends and your entire social network. You are leaving behind your culture, your history and your comfort zone. To think that people are cowards for not wanting to stick around is unfair. Its as brave a decision to leave as it is to stay!
Consider this an open invitation for us to debate the matter. I wish those that stay all the best. I wish nothing more then for SA to propser. You are just going to have to do it without me I am afraid. Im fed up.
September 6th, 2007 at 3:22 pm
Wait let me be Positive…Yeah I guess one day we will be able to sell some tomatoes/egg beater at the robots,of course when that day comes you know the goverment will finally outlaw street trading and the police will actually enforce it,you see nobody likes to see a white man making a buck in this hole anymore,they would prefer to see a white man begging on the road than a hundred black graduates,the need for revenge is strong and getting stronger….empower yourself and emigrate to a country where your tax money will actually be spent uplifting you and not used to discriminate against you….point me to 10 positive articles in the last week, wait I saw a couple when people weren’t killed when attacked we will have to put that down to positive because you know they were very lucky…
September 6th, 2007 at 3:31 pm
In response to the The Accountant:
Regarding BEE, I am well aware of the various BEE charters. I was a consultant for a venture capitalist firm a few years back. If only Government and most listed companies were actually prepared to deal with non compliant BEE companies in that 5 million to 35 million mark! Once you are turning over more the 5 million a year, it’s an uphill battle Im afraid. Reason being that skills are in such short supply, procurement is the checklist where most companies are focused.
I would like to suggest that perhaps you read the GEM reports. The report is a study of 40 odd countries throughout the world. In a nutshell, they basically determine how easy it is to start a small business in that particular country and sustain it. Go have a look at where we ranked. 40th out of 41 countries if I am not mistaken for 2006. We are not participating in the current one though. They factor in everything from the local labour market to access to finance. On average, 9 out of 10 South African business’ fail in the first year if I can remember correctly (its been a while since I read it) This is an independent study (Which I prefer when you consider how crime dropped 63% last week), so it does make for some very interesting reading.
http://www.gemconsortium.org/download/1189085330948/GEM2005.zip
http://www.gemconsortium.org
So your suggestion that a small business is the way to go appears to be very risky by international standards.
September 7th, 2007 at 1:36 pm
What the fuck is he complaining about? There are millions of people in his backyard far worse off than he is.
He needs my iScattlerlings Sunshine Management Course.
It is guaranteed to make him smile and see himself from the priveledged position he really is in.
September 7th, 2007 at 1:37 pm
What is he complaining about? There are millions of people in his backyard far worse off than he is.
He needs my iScattlerlings Sunshine Management Course.
It is guaranteed to make him smile and see himself from the priveledged position he really is in.
September 7th, 2007 at 5:45 pm
Ok, now this is a mongoloids mentality. Seriously. Your logic is warped.
So because most people live in poverty, I must count my lucky stars and stick around? Thats like saying because I earn 400k a year, there is no point me trying to earn 800k a year because 400k a year puts me in the top 1% already. Whats the point of being king if your domain is a mudhut?
Sorry mate. I expect a little too much from life I guess. If this is your reason for staying, you are as mad as a hatter. Or possibly a hippy. Maybe a mad hatter hippy?
September 9th, 2007 at 2:53 pm
When I read Preacher’s comments I find myself agreeing with many of his points. There is a lot going on in South Africa that frustrates me to no end. I also don’t see much of it being resolved any time soon because that would require a change in government but because we are a democracy and because of the government’s support base, that won’t be happening in a hurry either. The government comes up with some real gems at times, not least of which is its policy towards HIV/AIDS and telecommunications in South Africa. Some of our ministers should be fired for incompetence and their political connections keep them in office.
I could go on about our trade unions which are socialist in appearance only to maintain their support base and our government’s inability to recognise just how important the lower paid professions are and a lot more.
Ultimately though, being positive about South Africa can not be about saying that everything is great, there are no real problems because there are a number of real problems. Being positive about South Africa is remaining determined to create a space for yourself in this wild frontier. I was reading an article in Maverick about a white guy who grew up in a Zulu village with his family a few decades ago. He said South Africa is still pretty wild and I agree with him. This is such a paradoxical country but the one thing SA does have in abundance is potential. There is so much room for development and growth that it is a lot like riding out and staking your.
There are barriers to us whiteys, for sure, and I agree with Nic about that. Affirmative Actions programs are necessary. I just hope they are put to rest in the next few years when their rationale becomes inapplicable. At the same time there is an opportunity to carve out a space for yourself and live a decent living. I believe in that quite firmly and that was a consideration that motivated me to step out on my own 2 years ago.
As for emigration to a more developed/less violent/less corrupt/insert-description-here country, I would be lying if I said I haven’t considered it and don’t think about it now and again. There are opportunities elsewhere in the world for us and it may be really tough to make such a move, it also means that staying here becomes a choice you make every day. Make it for the right reasons.
September 12th, 2007 at 2:13 pm
Jawellnofine. I also used to be incredibly positive about SA. Lets face it, the early miracle was amazing. Madiba in his Springbok jersey at the world cup, the first elections, the amazing sense of purpose – but that all faded.
Yes, I am one of those who is now an expat! Why? As I said, I was very positive – I had a high powered, well paying job and had groomed myself for the top job – self funded studies, degrees in chem, honours, MBA, the lot. What happened? Passed over by a gentleman who now has to be supervised by his boss. Started my own business – lasted 18 months (success – more than a year!). Spent 9 months applying for many jobs and guess what – not even a repsonse, never mind an interview. I even applied for my old job back – bearing in mindthat I had 15 years experience in that industry many at senior management level, and was told that I was not what they required currently – job given to an AA. All that is guaranteed to wear out the most optimistic! What else was I to do?
So I took my last remaining money and moved to the UK. Yes it has been hard, I work all hours and travel all over the place. However with hard work has come reward. They still believe here in work or get out! Also, while I’m out, my wife can sit at home with the windows open – she can catch buses into town, she can go out with her friends, we can draw money at night, I can drive an old cheap car because it is safe to break down, I don’t have to spend a fortune on medical or security. I miss my friends and family and the outdoors, but come back? My question is ‘What is there to come back to?
September 12th, 2007 at 6:00 pm
That is the exact question I find myself asking right now. I left SA in 1998, my British (ex)husband wanted to live in the UK. I was okay with the idea, in fact I was quite excited at the prospect of living in a different country, being able to travel etc. Now almost 9 years later, I still miss South Africa tremendously, that has never gone away.. my family, my friends, the friendliness & vibrancy of the people. I feel as though I’ve lost touch though, 9 years is a long time to be away. I speak to people back home now & all I seem to hear about is the crime, the lack of jobs, that I’d be crazy to even consider going back. I’m coming over in December to see for myself, but I just can’t imagine calling the UK “home” and never living in South Africa again.
September 12th, 2007 at 6:11 pm
Electra, Contact me when you are here, we’ll go for coffee and talk. Things are not always what they seem or what you are told. People may disagree with me, but I think you should speak to positive and negative people who live here!
drop me an email!
September 14th, 2007 at 12:49 pm
i currently live in the UK (in edinburgh to be exact). I have never intended to stay here long term – always knew i was coming home – and am currently counting the days till I return (84). I disagree with so much of what the preacher has said but I will keep my response and substantive matter short and to the point – because although I cant back down from this argument – I know its like screaming at a brick wall, people like this will never waiver.
The grass is not greener: i live in a grotty basement flat in a dodgy area because despite my degree and good job, it’s all i can afford. I thought about buying a car but the compulsory taxes and insurances and mot’s took it straight out of the budget.
i work from 8:30 to 18:00 every day – in winter i do not see more than an hours daylight (during my lunch hour) and winter lasts 8 months of the year. I slog to HO in the rain and sleet, or take an overcrowded dirty, smelly bus to the offices in further parts of the city. I havent been away for a weekend in six months, and my garden is a 3ft by 4ft patch of cement.
and dont think you’re going to sashay straight into a job over here. You’ll get passed up for the locals while they bitch that the polish are stealing all their jobs. then the gov will take a third or more of your paycheck, collect your garbage once a fortnight and charge you the earth in council taxes to do so.
crime may be a swinging factor between europe and joburg, but joburg is not representative of all of south africa. My parents own two houses in the eastern cape. neither has burglar bars and we’ve had one (small) break-in in each in 25 years – one 15 years ago where they took the linen from our holiday house, and one about ten years ago when a cheeky teenager stole my bike which I had left outside anyway!!
I’ve found living in the uk an uphill battle – the only reason i stuck it out is because I know it was short term (you can bear most things when you know they will end) and because I have been saving to travel in europe. the things i will take from this experince are not all pleasant – they largely fit under the categories “life experience” and “growing up”.
September 20th, 2007 at 7:01 pm
Life is what you make of it. If you expect the worst, you’ll get the worst – simple as that. All the people above who complained about the negatives in SA and then left – I am not surprised! If you dwell on the negative, that is what you will focus on and that is what will be attracted into your life. Eventually, it then justifies why you should leave. For the record: I have been out of the country for 7 years, in the UK and US. Great countries, things work, bla bla and the rest of it, but come December I am moving back to SA to start my own business and I couldn’t be happier!!! SA, more than any place I know, is what you make of it.
August 10th, 2009 at 10:50 am
Hi Nic,
Taking a positive attitude is great. But it is not enough and will not restore the balance in ZA.
A few things you can not deny:
People migrate all the time. All of us are immigrants, or our forefathers were at some stage.
Moving countries are one of the best things to do (even if you live in a stable / balanced country). It opens your mind, broadens your horison and is considered one of the top things to do in life to make your life complete. – Have you ever lived / worked in another country for more than 3 years?
People are leaving ZA at an astonishing rate. People migrate because they are looking for better.
Hope this clarifies.
August 15th, 2009 at 4:18 pm
nic,
interesting article.
http://www.fin24.com/articles/default/display_article.aspx?ArticleId=1518-25_2003186
and yes, we are not coming back. never!
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